1 Confirmation with Jeff and Dave – Kevin Owocki with Gitcoin and Josh and Kevin with Peeps Democracy!
Jeff: Live from BTC manager world headquarters This is one confirmation with Jeff and David and I’m Jeff.
Dave: I’m Dave.
Jeff: And holy cow, the markets been exploding we got Bitcoin over $12,000 and holding Etheruem at over $400 and holding the deep five market cap the decentralized finance market cap is at 11.7 billion and all time high, largely led by the growth of urine finance at $10,600 today, and 50% increase in just the last 24 hours just what is going on with it market. Dave What do you think is going Gone with this market man?
Dave: It looks like they are going to like drive nothing, they are only going to drive the whole market the whole world, which seems like the way they are going. So this is really amazing.
Jeff: Yes, I think this is absolutely amazing. I mean when you got people in Turkey, selling their home selling their cars selling everything they have for gold and Ethereum and Bitcoin and all this. I think people are running for the hills. What about you, David, are you thinking of buying more now that everybody is buying in?
Dave: Well, in last couple of months, I’ve seen that in India, like the gold price was like increasing huge. Maybe 30%, this got increased in last couple of months. So a lot of people are investing a lot of money on gold buying gold. So that’s the one Bitcoin all people like not used, but gradually people are getting into it and by learning so that is how it’s going on in India on Bitcoin.
Jeff: Yes, that’s really interesting and then you got Bitcoin that a couple of very interesting stats on Bitcoin recently. China after a massive rainstorm hit the Sichuan Province. It shut down a lot of the mining pools there and that results in at a 15% drop in the ashtray along with that, the amount of Bitcoin that has been tokenized on Etheruem is exceeding the number of mined Bitcoin which and on top of that, people are buying Bitcoin like crazy. So they’re just a lot have an interest in this space and the last week so I think it’s just absolutely amazing. Just the amount of interest in all of this decentralized currency. And to top it off the US Federal Reserve in New York has finally figured out that Bitcoin is a little different than Fiat money. So what do you think about that David? Do you think the Federal Reserve is going to even start buying Bitcoin?
Dave: Yes. I’m not having much idea of it for us comment like how they are thinking but yes, the way it is going and the way it is designed, more secure, so definitely they are going to adopt it and going further they are going to use it.
Jeff: Yes, I think that’s the thing. If either, if you can’t beat them, join them of type of thing. And I think They’d be better off joining us. So along with that, and within the altcoin space, things are heating up as most recently Chainlink, which didn’t work coin has been going through the roof, although it’s dropped recently. And it’s Etheruem is very nearly ready to hit their 2.0 platform over the next few months. And so I think there’s going to be a lot more interest and a lot more people trying to join then with the cryptocurrency. And to talk about that today, I’ve invited some really amazing players in this space. And this includes Kevin with gitcoin.co, along with Joshua and Bill Warren, with peeps democracy. So Hello, everybody. Thanks for joining us.
Josh: Hey, Jeff, for some great to be here.
Jeff: Kevin, thanks for joining us.
Kevin: Thanks so much for having me. Jefferson, Bill, Josh, great to be on the podcast with you.
Jeff: So it’s awesome. Awesome.
So I just want to lead off, Kevin, if you can just talk a little bit more about your project, how it works. And then we’ll dive right into maybe how people can take advantage of it.
Kevin: For sure.
So Gitcoin is a place that you can get coins if you’re a software engineer. So the idea is that we enable people to earn by using Ether, and any token built on top of an Etheruem, and increasingly other blockchains we’ve been integrating with. So we’ve done about $6.5 million worth of rewards to open source software developers, and we’ve got an upcoming campaign called Get Coin Grants that’s going to launch in about three weeks. Basically it’s a big fundraising celebration for the Etheruem space, get coin grants has delivered about $3 million worth of value to projects in the Ethereum space. And some of the projects that you were just talking about in the lead in like you’re in finance have been recipients of Gitcoin grants during the bear market. So they were using Gitcoin grants to stay afloat and to innovate in the bear market. Now we’re seeing the fruits of that labor as the market starts to come back. So it’s a great pleasure to work with software engineers that help them pay their mortgage while they work on open source. And happy to dive in on that later. I’m also excited to be joined by the Peeps team. I think they’re doing some really great stuff as well.
Jeff: So with that, Joshua Bill, if you all want to talk about how Peeps got to start and what you’re doing today.
So you know, we’re also big fans of Kevin and especially on some of the open-source kind of community projects we work on. Like Moloch Mystics and MedicArtel Gitcoin has been an important funding source for those projects for us, but obviously also for the ecosystem. Peep started out focused on Daws before people started calling them Dows again, you know, when we started in late 2018, it was still close enough to the Dow hack that people had PTS Dow. But since then we’ve continued to focus on allowing people to collect tokens together, or fund causes and movements were a little bit like Gitcoin in that except that we focus much more on social movements, causes and soon kind of like physical projects, so creating works of art, and funding those funding purchases of real property like timeshares on Etheruem, creating pools for investing and defy coins. And that’s all going to be part of our pool party platform where people can create a Dow all the money in the Dow gets invested into idol finance, which optimizes the interest across a couple of platforms like Ave and compound. And that way as people are saving for a shared goal, they’re also earning some interest on their bags of money in the Dow. So that’s what we’re most excited about, in addition to continuing to help nonprofits and other social movements in the space from their causes.
Jeff: This is an amazing let’s take a step back. I mean, one of the things about the shows we tried to bring on people that are completely new to this space, tried to keep crypt if you will, what all this means. So, to take a step back, you know, Dave as a software developer. It’s a list of magic. He wanted to create a project. And I’m just making up anything. Perhaps it’s to organize a local government project to perhaps even to run against a local mayor. You know, perhaps that local mayor is totally corrupt. And, you know, David wants to vote against him. How could he take advantage of your platform? Bill to start with, to get further along in his goals and efforts?
Bill: Yes, great question. So with our platform, all David would have to do is go on peepsdow.com create his own Dow through a web form, and then do the really tough work of getting a community and building that to support his run. You know, one thing we do with Peeps Dow that’s a little bit different from other Dow is we create an option for political campaigns. payments are nonprofits where they might be a little bit more regulated to require donors to provide the information that regulators would look for. That way, when David has to file his campaign finance reports with the government so that he can avoid getting in trouble himself. He can easily pull that from our system. But we are focused on making dow creation very, very easy. The thing that we unfortunately can’t do for people is build the communities for them. And that’s where the real hard work begins.
Jeff: That’s awesome.
Dave, what do you think about running for mayor and India, if you were to run for mayor, could you use this type of a platform?
Dave: Yes, this seems very interesting and very good application. One question I’m having is like when we are running a nonprofit organization or if someone is donating, then they are getting a tax benefit, right. So, do we have such kind of thing and this the one that you have done, so the people who are donating for the government for some good cause for some kind of thunderstorm happen or some kind of flood comes and people donate for to the government to do their good job. So, in that case, the people also get some kind of certificate, some kind of document so they can end up here, they can pray that, hey I have donated to the government and I want tax benefit of it. Do you have kind of thing as well as this?
Bill: So, that depends a lot on the organization that’s using the platform. If they have registered with the government as a charity, then people can absolutely take a write off for the contributions they make to that Peeps Dow. And the nice thing about Etheruem which is true for both our platform and I know get coin has also done some work with some amazing 501C3s is that the transaction is captured pretty immediately on a theorem. So, you immediately have a receipt for your contribution to the organization and you know, again assuming the organization is registered as a tax-exempt organization, you can go ahead and take that tax write off.
Dave: Okay, I have one more question on this.
So if let the poll we have a constant people has donated, right. So those that all the people would be able to see that of what the total collection that happened into that and then where all that get banded where all the things are done with that font so they can see that with all transactions in one book?
Bill: Yes, that’s right.
So within the Dow platform, right. We collect funds. So you can see everybody who’s been a donor to the fund, though people might be sued anonymous. And then, on the other end, when it comes to spending, the spending has to be approved by all of the donors who vote to pass proposals or the donors can always vote against a proposal or even rage quit the Dow if they’re really unhappy with the nature of the proposal. So it does create a transparent system from end to end, which we believe is good for nonprofits so that they can show that they’re really are accountable to their donors and kind of following through on the mission as they’re supposed to. And it’s also good for donors because it engages them much more heavily in the nonprofit if they want to be engaged
Dave: That’s really great.
Jeff: This is really, really awesome. One of the things I was thinking about it actually the flip side of this coin, so to speak, which are people that are even looking forward. There’s a lot of schools, you know, where they try to bring kids in to learn coding and things like that. Do you think there might be a way to combine the efforts even Peeps democracy along with Gitcoin to provide that amazing on ramp to paying work, so to speak?
Bill: Yes, so there are actually two ways that we’ve seen Gitcoin be really useful. Some of our organizations have raised small get coin grants and then put those grants into their Peeps Dow. And then of course, the other side of that, which we haven’t seen yet, but hope to for sure, is that people could create bounties on bitcoins platform for software development. And that way you really do have end to end integration with Gitcoin through the community, a Joshua had something too.
Josh: Yes, I’d like to add that. One of the neat things that you could do with a pool party specifically in this, we’ve seen someone with like the micro teachers where during the Coronavirus people like neighbors have come together and paid for teacher doing work for like small pods of kids. And what the Dow could do is raise money to then vote on a proposal to pay out a teacher and so PTA is could use it. Small neighborhood groups could use it.
Bill: Yes, and they’d all earn interest on the Dow funds until they actually spend them which is kind of a nice bonus given that you can earn 5% to 6% on dye or USDC versus 0.15% on your bank account if you’re lucky.
Jeff: And, you know, there never be a run, so to speak on that bank, unlike other locations like Turkey so along with that, I know that there’s been a lot of development that you all have been working on as well. So Kevin How can Getcoin so to speak, how all of this keep going, I mean, I know Peeps democracy, I have a lot of work done. They still need to need a lot more work done. There’s more projects to the table. I mean, do you think there would be a run on Gitcoin?
Kevin: Well, I should clarify that Gitcoin is called Gitcoin because it’s a place where you can get coins, but it’s not actually a token so there can’t be a run on Getcoins because there’s no asset as of what are we ending August 2020, to buy. So the sort of thing that we’re doing in order to help projects like peeps and other projects in the Etheruem space is just trying to scale Gitcoin grants. So one of the cool things about the Ethereum space is that all of these projects are composable with each other. So get coins is just focused really on being really good at grants and quadratic funding, which is the mathematical formula that powers Gitcoin grants. And just by focusing on that, doing that one thing and doing it well, hopefully, we can help all the other projects in the space that are trying to do other things and do them well with funding. We’re just going to take quadratic funding down from and get coin grants from doing 150k per quarter. I’m hoping to doing 10 X that this time, next year. That’s how we’re we’re sort of focused on helping other projects in the space move forward, but would be cool to explore other opportunities specifically with Peeps, because I feel very mission aligned with the work that you all are doing.
Bill: Yes, we would love to have a Dow or I guess one of our hopes with Pool Party is that we have a dowel that can actually be one of the matching fund donors to get [overlap].
Kevin: Yes, I think we need to do a better job of allowing trustless escrow of matching funds because right now it all just goes to a wallet that I own, not that I own but like the you know, like the keys from in distributing the trust, I think will be important because the trust model of Dow’s is somewhat. The Ethereum foundation funds a lot of the grants that we do right now. And the trust model of the Ethereum Foundation is slightly different than the trust model of a Daw. But yes, eventually we will get there.
Bill: Yes, we’re still young as a community I think that’s the cool thing about this space is we’re still growing and discovering all of this together.
Josh: I was really excited to see how close my former project has been working with Gitcoin, [unintelligible 00:19:16]. They’ve done a lot of with Gitcoin.
Kevin: Yes, for sure. What’s cool is that metallic in one of his Gitcoin grants review posts had said that Gitcoin grants could be an institution that many projects in the Ethereum space rely on for funding, and that it could be like a composable layer that other projects are building on top of as well. So Pinnawala has, they basically have a native token called Pan which is designed to also help open source software. And they’re the number three token below Ethan dye. They’re the number three token that’s donated on Gitcoin grants, which I think it kind of speaks to the promise and the mission alignment that they’ve had. I think one Pan is $0.40 right now. So yes, curious to see what they do for round seven.
Josh: So it was up to 11. That’s really cool. It just keeps climbing. That’s the power of Gitcoin right there.
Jeff: So that’s to be projects have actually started with basically zero and nothing or whatever. And now, many of these projects are getting off the ground and really getting a lot of success and all independent from mainstream finance. Is that right?
Bill: Yes, I mean, I wouldn’t say independent from mainstream finance, I’d say somewhat parallel to mainstream finance. I mean, we still have to follow all applicable laws in the United States like KYC type laws. But yes, I mean, it’s kind of really amazing to be able to distribute money in this way without having to go through a traditional financial institution, it’s kind of guys and gals and T shirts instead of people in suits. And maybe that’s the way the finance is going.
Kevin: Yes, especially for the early stage projects where you’re just like an exploratory mode. You know, that’s where I’ve seen Gitcoin grants be incredibly powerful. Because for some of the, like, Moloch Dow is a Dow framework that’s used by several, companies and organizations in the community, and to fund the further development of Moloch Dow, it’s not like there’s a great VC or other funding organization that we can go to. But we can go to Gitcoin grants and get the couple thousand dye that we need to do an audit of our work or reimburse the people who have spent hours and hours building the new smart contracts. And that’s a really incredible tool for this space. And, you know, like Kevin said, it’s helping the space develop in a much more open source way versus web two where everything was closed because you are getting funding from a VC that’s worried about your competitive moats beyond anything else.
Jeff: Yes, I think that’s what I mean, by mainstream. I mean, consider the usual ways that, if you open up, Inc magazine, they say, you have to go to a bank or go to the FBA or go to vulture capitalists, I like to call them you know, or that sort of thing. Or potentially your friends and family, but if you don’t know anybody, it’s like, where do you go so here I think we have a new rail finance that is maturing rapidly. If you look at all the Dows that are out there now is retiring rapidly to be able to explore some of these amazing new projects, right?
Bill: Yes, absolutely. And one of the things that’s is very important with a lot of these new projects as they pop up is that they need to be audited. And I think we found over the past few weeks that people are willing to throw absurd amounts of money into things that are not audited. I think that’s one of the great things that Gitcois’s going to be doing over the next few weeks is helping kind of democratize the audit space where people that wouldn’t normally be able to get audited could be able to afford one.
Jeff: Potentially, developer say out of India and you had this great idea for a project, maybe, Bill and Kevin, can you just outline a couple of steps take it like Inc magazines. What are the five things that an innovative developer out of India might want to consider when starting up?
Kevin: Yes, I’d say that get clean grants, we run 150K matching rounds every quarter for developers in the space, anyone can create a grant. And the matching funds are distributed by the number of your peers that respect and want to fund your project. So as opposed to having to apply to a grant with a centralized entity, where you would have to cozy up to some power broker or to some grant giver. It’s really just about whether or not your peers respect to the project and I think that that’s the power of permissionless finance. So open up a Gitcoin grant round seven of matching starts in September, September 15th. And open up a Gotcoin grant and convince your peers that your project is legit not a power broker and get coin can get you some seed capital. So that’s the Gitcoins side of the equation, I’ll hand over to Bill and Josh to, to mention how Peeps can help.
Kevin’s right like step one, do a Gitcoin grants, try and raise and get some grants from developers. Then step two would be, once you have that Gitcoin grant, create a pool party or Peeps Daw where you can start to build the community, get more stakeholders to almost literally buy into your project in a way that provides you with some additional funding in exchange for giving up maybe a little bit of the power over the direction of the project. So, it really is a powerful tool once you’re in the community building phase, and have maybe a little bit of a fan base already from your Gitcoin round. I’d say Step three is just build something amazing and that gets people excited.
Bill: Don’t be afraid to fail fast either. I have five projects I’ve built in the space before Gitcoin and no one knows what they are. But the learning experiences were valuable. I think it’s really important to leave your sunk costs on a project that clearly isn’t working.
Jeff: Yes, exactly. I mean, Elon Musk. How many times did he fail before SpaceX, I mean, holy cow.
Could you imagine going to your investors and saying, I want to build rockets to get off this planet? That’s okay. So don’t be afraid to think big either. So David, what do you think about developers and India do you think don’t be afraid to go on to Gitcoins and try out their big ideas?
Dave: Well, developers over here, they don’t get scared of failing. They go try. Keep trying. Keep trying. They know that like, they will be succeeded one day. So that is the theory, especially the people who really wants to do that. Not everyone, some people, they want to be successful in the very first row. This get tall success, not the big one. So yes, you will find a lot of people here. They did both scared of failing.
Jeff: So they’ll be able to create a project. I mean, what advice do you think would be needed to get a project off the ground there?
Dave: Yes, definitely. And I love to do that project. I have one question for Kevin and Bill and probably Josh. When you guys are going to launch this application in India. People like will be a loving that, because they are getting money to the government and they don’t know where that money goes. They are like, Ah, so that is something that I want to see here in India. People like politician away corrupt. So, that’s my question for you.
Kevin: Dave, I’d asked you a question back. How does crowdfunding work for smaller local projects now? Like so if there’s like a pothole or something that needs to be fixed?
Dave: The funding here, if someone comes into some fun like, Hey, this is fun for the country, for your religion, right. People don’t think anything when it comes to their people. So they are happy to raise a good part, anytime subplot comes, maybe you will find that a million of employees that donate their one day five days a lot of there are like a portal that sort of being just like amazing. They start open some, do you want to raise any funds, or do you want to pay or give a fund to the government go they’re pay it, to me found hundreds of places there. So raising fund is not a problem here. Like the people most scared is like whatever I’m raising, is that exactly reaching to the right people or not, that’s very important.
Jeff: I mean, just trying to think or rip up the idea of your own, there’s the Argent wallet, right, which I think is an incredible, incredible Wallet for being able to add contacts and all like that, but you know, same deal. A lot of this is all in I see a lot of these amazing projects are all in English. So perhaps, maybe a compelling Gitcoin grand might be localization into 100 different languages, these amazing projects. So with that Dave, what do you think? Could you create a project to localize and promote, like the Argent wallet and all these different things?
Dave: Well, definitely that is doable. And we can do that. And sometimes, like some government also propose this, like if you have something authentic because not everyone is correct, right. Someone like is good. So they promote you. And once you get some promotion, then your application will be on top of everything. And localization is not a big day in that small kind of thing that we can do it in any application.
Bill: Yes, that’s a great idea is using Gitcoin to help localize software projects, a lot of the projects right now in the Ethereum space, seem to be built in English or other kind of languages that originated in Western Europe, maybe Mandarin Chinese for others. And there is this entire world out there that could really benefit from a more open economy, like the one that Gitcoin and Peeps is trying to build. And Gitcoin already has the perfect platform for finding the people that can work on the localization efforts and get paid for their work.
Kevin: Yes, I think it’s an interesting use of funds.
And I just think like that we’re not really good about being localized right now. Gitcoin grants is still heavily under construction as we try to solve some major quadratic funding powers Gitcoin grants, but there’s some major unsolved research problems there. And we’ve just been hyper focused on those and haven’t done a good job of localization. But yes, I think that it’s something that’s super important as though the world open source financial system goes worldwide is doing localization and being inclusive of those local communities, especially those that don’t speak English.
Jeff: Very, very cool. So I think this is probably the start, I really feel that this is probably the start of that next phase of massive, massive growth, or this entire space. Very much like the early days of the internet, you know, right after, bottom lane can, you know, the early days of AOL you had or Clank and then it went global, right. So I think we’re right about at that point, we’re about right, about a billion people are going to jump into this platform.
So which leads to the question, do you think it’s possible in any way that if you had 100 million people, I’ll try to do something on there that everything would crash?
Bill: So we think the challenge that we’re probably all experiencing in the Ethereum space is the rise and gas fees that have come with more interest in defy. So we’ve seen the price of launching a Peep Dow go from $15, a couple of months ago when we first launched to some days, it’s over $100 just in gas fees alone. And, you know, a lot of Dow projects like Dow house and others have, Aragon have seen this exact same jump in prices. And so Peeps is also part of the Dow house effort where we’re working on ways to use layer two solutions so that we can address that scalability issue and can really bring down the cost period. Because, while for a US audience, creating a Peeps Dow for $15 is a great deal, you know, when compared against opening a bank account or creating an organization in the US and registering it with Delaware, it might be pretty expensive for people and a lot of places in the country through using a layer two solution like Xdye or the steak network, you know, we think that we can get that down to less than $1 to create a Peeps Down and then a cent or less in terms of interacting with the actual Peep Dow.
Jeff: That’s great. And I know the Etheruen 2 is not that far away either. Which I’ve been just going to phase zero. It’s going to eliminate a lot of the what I call the garbage transactions, right. Which show them right there, that’ll free up space, right. So I think that’s the amazing thing about this is that none of this is stopping. I mean, that’s the beauty that I have of this is there are no barriers to growth. Unlike, with the Etheruen economy, there are a lot of barriers to growth. I mean, all they can keep doing is adding zeros, and there are barriers to doing so, right. So, I think this is fantastic.
Well, with that, I think we covered a lot of topics. Are there any additional thoughts from anybody, on anything that we covered here today?
Kevin: I think that we’re kind of like in the first inning or the second inning of this stuff. Bitcoins been around for 10 years. And we’re already starting to see some really hugely potential things that are happening there. The analogy I make is with the internet, you know, the first internet was really clunky and hard to use, but it changed the way we move information across the world. So basically, like instead of having to be the New York Times and have a huge distribution in order to get your ideas out there, you could use a blog and instantly get distribution. And I think that we’ve democratized information in the first internet. And now we’re democratizing access to finance. And so if you’re listening to this, and you’re thinking, Oh, I’m too late, you’re not, we’re only in the first or second inning of this, and this is going to take multiple decades to play out. So just try to learn something every day. And Jefferson’s podcast is a great way to do that. Follow Gitcoin follow Peeps on Twitter, and just learn more every day. And I think that those information gains are going to compound over time. So there’s a lot to Learn here and the world’s changing fast. But I placed an emphasis on learning.
Josh: Yes, same.
I think, if we were to put it in internet years, it’s like we’re in 1995, 1996 right now, you know, we might progress faster than the internet did, but it’s still super early days. So get involved, learn. There are a lot of great projects in this space like Gitcoin like Peeps, like Dale Dow like Moloch. You know, just learning started getting involved in experimenting.
Jeff: I think one of the most fascinating things about Gitcoin is that you don’t have to be a programmer to use it. You do not. There’s plenty of work for example, localization, you know, writing manuals, there’s a lot of different work on there. That is not programming work. But it is related to helping decentralize finance so you can get involved and not be a programmer, and still have tremendous, tremendous success.
David, do you have any final thoughts?
Dave: The KV, like, whatever you mentioned is like we are an early stage. And this is a time to get involved in it, and then start using it. This is the future, just like we have seen the internet at any sharing. So definitely this is going to be a future of the finance.
Bill: Yeah, and I’d also say that Gitcoin has some of the best swag in the ecosystem. So check out their store, Kevin’s shirt is making me jealous.
Couple like Gitcoin shirts and stickers and stuff, and it’s sweet.
Kevin: If you’re listening to this and you want some swag DM me I’ll give you a coupon code. I’ll give it to a cost.
Jeff: That’s an awesome deal. I might take you up
Josh: Me too.
Jeff: Joshua, any final thoughts?
Josh: Yes, one of my favorite things that is very cohesive between our projects Gitcoin and peeps is that there’s a focus on sustainability. So like, messing around on the D5 space, you notice that there’s a lot of flash, not a lot of substance. At least right now, there is some substance but right now it’s a lot of flash and the with the pool party, what we’re trying to focus on is like long term savings and long term growth, more long term stability. I think that’s what you get.
Jeff: Yes, that’s one of the things I was thinking about. I mean, if you had even $10,000 in a Dow, you know, over the course of a year, you would make back more than any of the costs are starting that Dow, which is certainly more than you can say for hoping in your bank account anywhere. So, I mean, that’s certainly something to think about. So I think also another thing to think about it, I remember the very early days of the internet, which is bulletin boards. That’s after 1984, that movie War Games, I got online. And I started going onto bulletin boards session, which might be akin to, the early days of Bitcoin where Satoshi and those guys were fooling around with the early protocols and stuff like that. And then after that, a little company called modern computer services came along and started PC link and Apple link and that sort of thing, which I compared to even Etheruen 1 where you can kind of get things done, but there’s a lot of crazy stuff when it comes to Etheruen and you know, where it doesn’t quite work for example of Gatsby 200. Then you go on to Etheruen 2 which I’ll compared to today’s or Earthlings. So yes, you’re absolutely right, folks, this is still the early days, you do not need a lot of capital to get in as a matter of fact, as I pointed out of this show. You need zero capital basically, to get started. You only need a few minutes to sign up for gitcoin.co outline your project and talk to people and see if you can get them on board with your project. And it’s a twofold one right now. I mean, where else can you go, honestly. And somebody had somebody come up to you say, I will double whatever money you put up towards the project. I mean, if you go to the bank, no, they’ll take your money. If you go to a venture capitalist, they’ll say no, you just you need to get 100 customers to probably give you money. And here you got the folks at Etheruen Foundation and cabinet and Gitcoin and even Bill saying sign up and for no money, we’ll get you started.
So yes, I would encourage anybody to listen to this podcast. Check it out. This is deal with a century as Peep says, this is a deal of a century. So it was great to have everybody on this show. This is a fantastic show. Kevin, Bill, Josh, David, this is great. Any parting thoughts?
Bill: Thanks so much for having us, Jefferson. Looking forward to continuing on this defy adventure with all of you. Maybe we should do another podcast in a year and see how the world has changed.
Josh: Yes, it was great talking with all of you. I second Kevin’s idea. Let’s talk in a year and see where we are. Hopefully, we’ll be talking about how awesome Eath 2 is and how the ecosystem is 10 next since then.
Kevin: I’ve already put it on my calendar. Thank you so much for having us.
Jeff: Alright. Thanks, everybody. Thanks, everybody. Well, this has been a great show. This is one confirmation with BTC manager. And I’m Jeff.
Dave: I’m Dave.
Jeff: And thanks for having us.
Dave: Thank you, everyone.